Recruiting Issues

Amaroo · Post by **Amaroo** » Sat Apr 12, 2008 7:32 pm

It has come to my attention, and a few others who shall remain nameless, that the way we have been recruiting is a bit too lenient. Someone asks to join, and more often than not, they are permitted without really doing a thorough follow-up on them.

I mean, quite a few of the new/former members, the ones who have left, or the ones on the verge of leaving/kicked are a bit, shall we say immature, demanding, over zealous on minor issues, to name a few. Which has been causing alot of drama internally with R.I.D.

I suggest when a person is sponsored into the guild, before being permitted full membership, that a panel of at least 2 officers meet, talk, associate, group with or anything of the like, with the potential recruits to get a better feel for their personalities, quirks and what not.

More insight needs to be gained on the recruits before they are really given a chance to cause any drama, fights, etc.

Would appreciate any additions, questions, or anything productive on this matter to be discussed with the rest of the Officers, than the guild as a whole, once we get better guidelines set.

Post by **Lexx Yovel** » Sat Apr 12, 2008 9:28 pm

I've got nothing against it.

All that it will require is "on the call" support from any of the Commanders, Captains that are online.

To be honest though, its a bit difficult to evaluate someones personality during an interview. During all my interviews they've listend to what I've had to say, answered questions, and asked any that they might have.

It's only when they start to meet these other personalities and their strong sense of greed/self interest kicks in that this drama sparks from even the pettiest of issues.

I do agree that perhaps a panel of 2 officers would be suitable. Its quite likely they will catch personality aspects better than myself, and know them better.

I do like the idea of posting applications on this forum. I plan to post all the applications I have submitted by pending-recruits on this forum so everyone in this forum can vote on it. Debating whether to put it in the public "Personal Database" forum for vote, or just here amongst the Commanders/Captains.

Apium · Post by **Apium** » Sat Apr 12, 2008 10:44 pm

We could have a requirement where the potential recruit would have to go through one RID group with an officer present (assuming the person is level 90).

Thats just one idea, but the recruitment policy probably needs to be reworked entirely from the ground up.

Kurke Aumea · Post by **Kurke Aumea** » Sun Apr 13, 2008 10:17 am

I think a lot of the issues lately come from the fact that there is a large maturity gap between players in the guild. One one side, we have the teenagers who aren't afraid to express their opinion, who won't always shut up, and who can just act like immature jack asses at times (I'm not grouping them all in there). On the other side we have a group of various aged players who just don't want to deal with the high school bull shit. Moonlighters aside, it seems like all of the drama comes from the younger crowd. Am I saying we need an age requirement? No. Age isn't always an indicator of maturity. To prove that point, I give you our guild leader.

The real bitch is that most of the arguments lately seem to revolve around one thing, looting. Aside from Taiwo having his blowup because of Red's prodding, everyone seems to be getting into a hissy about loot rules or how people are handling loot.

Could we re-work the entire recruiting process and come up with the same issues. I think in the end we'd end up with a complicated recruiting system that requires a lot of effort to make it work. How much effort are we going to go through for a new recruit?

I think the one issue I have is that I've yet to see our official recruiting policies. I just think the rules fluctuate so often with our policies to accomodate various issues or situations that we've lost some of our consistency.

Barney · Post by **Barney** » Sun Apr 13, 2008 11:01 am

I actually have to disagree on one point with you Kurke, I think the drama I keep getting is from the adults who have little tolerance for the teenagers. All the complaints and tells and bitching I get from people or that I actually tell other people (I lose my cool and get irritated too) is from the ADULTS who are irritated and annoyed with the high spirits and basic sense of disrespect that the teenagers show to everyone else in the way they act and talk.

I have yet to get a single tell or complaint from any teenager about any adult in this game, they all come from the adults about the teenagers. When Red runs his groups and they do things like change the loot around, the only people in their groups who raise fusses over it are the grown ups. The teenage kids seems to all agree and get along just fine.

My way of handling my own irritation at some of the teenage high spirits is just to limit myself from interacting with them too much. I am old enough to be their mother, and I know my own limitations in patience, so I just avoid the problems and take one of two stands : don't group with them unless I'm willing to go with the flow, ignore the silly trash talk, and just relax and enjoy the time with them or go with them only after sternly reminding myself they are teenagers, they're gonna make sex jokes, rude potty humor, and gonna change their minds and group at the drop of a hat and learn to just shrug and accept that's how teenagers run.

I wish other adults could be more accepting of the nature of a teenager, or at least accepting of their own intolerance enough to not PUT THEMSELVES in situations where the conflicts happen in the first place.

The only discipline I feel is VERY necessary is that there can be no trash talking in guild chat. The kidds can play around all they want in their groups and private conversations, but please don't bring it to the "dinner table" as it were. I think the greatest maturity in any teenager is knowing when and when not to do the "talk".

As far as recruitment, yeah too many creepizoids are sneaking in. Now on top of it all Geedo is inferring that Lexx knew all along who he was when he was recruited. Whoah, that's a bombshell I'm waiting for an officer to lose his cool over. It all comes down to one simple rule, just like in a group, ultimately, Lexx is the guild leader and its his guild. He will/can/does guild whoever he feels like it. This does invite a lot more teenagers and some of the pvpleetkiddies like Geedo from time to time, and does cause problems between the adult players. If this continues, eventually the adults WILL move on somewhere else with less kid-talk, and Lexx will have a guild of mostly teenagers. Hey, nothing wrong with that, lotta guilds are like that. If he is concerned about the maturity level of RID and wants to keep his adult members, eventually he'll either have to get more picky and careful, or start taking into account a more concil-officer-oriented group effort type way of recruiting people.

Personally, I LOVE the balance in RID. I miss the company of my pre-teen son very much, and enjoy the company of the younger players because they help me not be so full of myself all the time and remind me how to have fun and let loose. I think this guild is the ultimate guild for parents who want to share the game with their kids (mature older ones that can handle some adult issues not 7 year olds that we have to watch our language around lol) or who do enjoy occasional if not all the time company of teenagers.

Here is like just an idea of how we COULD coordinate recruiting a little bit more if Lexx wanted our involvement more in the recruiting process.

How about just a short xx-point checklist. Like
1. Interview
2. Spent in a RID group led by a RID officer
3. Spent in a second RID group led by a SECOND RID officer
4. Invited to ventrilo (we can change passwords or block them later right? there is NO BETTER WAY to get to know someone than through voice chatting)
6. Application
7. Attendance ata RID social event (if we get those rolling weekly)
8. Membership on the RID forums.
9. Posting of application on a thread here for officers to share views
10. Xoseh digs up dirt on them and investigates them

If we made these things requirements, or some of them, it would be simple, but also gives us all a feeling of a lot more control over our recruitment. It will slow it down, which we're trying to do anyway, and also weed out people who might not be wanted in the guild anyway.

See, one of the things I learned is it's important to SLOW DOWN the application process. People should not be guilded, unless they come with a personal sponsorship or recommendation like a relative or friend, too soon. If they can't hang with the idea of waiting just a little bit of time before they are guilded, most likeley they are too impatient and immature and selfish or demanding to be worth having in our guild anyway.

Kurke Aumea · Post by **Kurke Aumea** » Sun Apr 13, 2008 4:14 pm

Barney wrote:I actually have to disagree on one point with you Kurke, I think the drama I keep getting is from the adults who have little tolerance for the teenagers. All the complaints and tells and bitching I get from people or that I actually tell other people (I lose my cool and get irritated too) is from the ADULTS who are irritated and annoyed with the high spirits and basic sense of disrespect that the teenagers show to everyone else in the way they act and talk.

I think I worded myself wrong. What I was trying to say was what you pointed out was that due to the way the younger folks can be sometimes, the older folks don't have much tolerance for it.

And while I think the older crowd should sometimes be more tolerant of the younger people, is it too much to ask for a little respect in guild chat from the younger ones? It's one thing if you are in tells or a group of young peeps and want to have a potty humor conversation, but sometimes it gets a little carried away in guild chat or in groups of mixed old and young.

Overall I'm saying that the maturity difference out there tends to play a big part in all of the drama and there's a lot of drama over really stupid things.

Post by **Lexx Yovel** » Sun Apr 13, 2008 5:17 pm

I certainly didn't know 'Aresius' was Geedo when I recruited him. I was thinking he was perhaps the same Aresius who was in TIO a looong time ago, however I did have my suspicions that it may not have been him. Although I never would have guessed it was Geedo until pretty much just now. In fact, most of you may have heard me speaking to him during an interview right before he was recruited (which was actually inside a base during a base bust, since it was a busy night and we had to multi-task).

Your recruitment policy sounds fine. Although we should take into account that not all recruits may be the type who are interested in heroics/combat groups altogether, so they may not even get the chance to find themselves in such a group, especially if they are of a lower level or non-combat profession. I would like all the Commanders/Captains to actively get involved in interviewing. I also like the idea of requiring them to become a user of the RID forums before recruiting.

Apium · Post by **Apium** » Sun Apr 13, 2008 6:35 pm

I think we should put this off until after we rework the divisions. Lets just take a quick vote on a temporary (and simple) recruitment policy that will hold up for several weeks.

Barney · Post by **Barney** » Sun Apr 13, 2008 6:47 pm

actually yes, Geedo states he is the same Aresius from TIO.

And no, I don't care if you knew or not, Geedo only said "Lexx told me he had suspicions I was Geedo" not a time frame but he kinda said it in such a way that made it sound like Lexx knew when he recruited him.

Either way we're in for a penny or a pound, if we make the choice to keep him and give him a chance, eventually people will know who he is, eventually they'll point fingers at us for making that choice if he screws up REALLY big with the RID tag. Personally, I am not too worried about it and willing to take that chance.

Barney · Post by **Barney** » Mon Apr 14, 2008 3:26 am

Can we ask for ONE question added to the application for new recruits? I would like to know what their SOE forum names are. Then Xoseh, could look up the people's posts and kinda look through how they post on the forums as research in secret police stuff, to get a feel for what kinda people they are and how they talk to other gamers in the forums, which really do bring out the worst in everyone mostly.

Xoseh · Post by **Xoseh** » Mon Apr 14, 2008 5:42 am

Barney wrote:Can we ask for ONE question added to the application for new recruits? I would like to know what their SOE forum names are. Then Xoseh, could look up the people's posts and kinda look through how they post on the forums as research in secret police stuff, to get a feel for what kinda people they are and how they talk to other gamers in the forums, which really do bring out the worst in everyone mostly.

Everyone keeps voulenteering me for everything lol. But yeah, I can do that.

I support this idea.